<html><body><div style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: #000000"><div>Hi Amrit,<br data-mce-bogus="1"></div><div><br data-mce-bogus="1"></div><div>As far as initial operating parameters, the following is a good starting point;<br></div><div><br data-mce-bogus="1"></div><div>1. C4H10 gas temp, 75-80F<br data-mce-bogus="1"></div><div>2. C4H10 gas inlet pressure to MFC, 20 psi<br data-mce-bogus="1"></div><div>3. Pressure control 12-15 psig<br data-mce-bogus="1"></div><div>4. ALL MFC temp, 75-80F<br data-mce-bogus="1"></div><div><br data-mce-bogus="1"></div><div>The Argon and CF4 gas lines at the MFC input and output should also be heated and insulated in order to properly maintain MFC temp. The MFCs and piping must be sealed to prevent C4H10 condensation due to the cold ambient air. The MFC mounting plate should be thermally insulated from the steel rack it is mounted in. This would be a good start.<br data-mce-bogus="1"></div><div><br data-mce-bogus="1"></div><div>The current MFC and piping layout is problematic for temp control. This layout should be re-designed keeping the following priorities in mind;<br data-mce-bogus="1"></div><div><div style="" data-mce-style="">- make it easy to insulate<br style="" data-mce-style=""></div><div style="" data-mce-style="">- make it easy to heat<br style="" data-mce-style=""></div><div style="" data-mce-style="">- minimize the gas line length between the MFC and gas cylinder pressure requlator<br style="" data-mce-style=""></div><div style="" data-mce-style="">A layout similar to my original concept along with some additional considerations for the heat tape and insulation would cover these priorities.<br style="" data-mce-style=""></div><div style="" data-mce-style=""><br style="" data-mce-style=""></div><div style="" data-mce-style="">George</div></div><div><br></div><hr id="zwchr" data-marker="__DIVIDER__"><div data-marker="__HEADERS__"><b>From: </b>"Amrit Yegneswaran" <yeg@jlab.org><br><b>To: </b>"Marc Mcmullen" <mcmullen@jlab.org><br><b>Cc: </b>"rossi patrizia" <rossi@jlab.org>, "Bob Miller" <rmiller@jlab.org>, "dsg-mvt" <dsg-mvt@jlab.org>, dsg-ft@jlab.org, "Todd Ewing" <jtewing@jlab.org><br><b>Sent: </b>Tuesday, January 2, 2018 7:50:42 PM<br><b>Subject: </b>Re: [Dsg-mvt] MVT MFC Heaters<br></div><div><br></div><div data-marker="__QUOTED_TEXT__"><div style="font-family: tahoma,new york,times,serif; font-size: 14pt; color: #009900" data-mce-style="font-family: tahoma,new york,times,serif; font-size: 14pt; color: #009900;"><div><div>hi george,<br></div><div>thanks for the excellent explanation about the saturation curve, it is most useful.</div><div>since we, the dsg, have chased our tails on this issue for quite a while, i suggest that you come up with a set of conditions for the gas, temp, and pressure something like;</div><ol><li>gas temp T<span style="font-size: 8pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 8pt;">gas</span>>70F</li><li>gas inlet pressure P<span style="font-size: 8pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 8pt;">in</span> : 20 psig<P<span style="font-size: 8pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 8pt;">in</span><25psig</li><li>gas oulet pressure P<span style="font-size: 8pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 8pt;">out</span> : 15 psig<P<span style="font-size: 8pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 8pt;">out</span><16psig</li><li>MFC temperature T<span style="font-size: 8pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 8pt;">MFC </span>: 50F<T<span style="font-size: 8pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 8pt;">MFC <span style="font-size: 14pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 14pt;"><122F</span></span></li></ol><div><span style="font-size: 8pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 8pt;"><span style="font-size: 14pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 14pt;">once these conditions have been met we can see how we can work the interface software and controls.</span></span></div><div><br></div><div><span style="font-size: 8pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 8pt;"><span style="font-size: 14pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 14pt;"><br></span></span></div><div><span style="font-size: 8pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 8pt;"><span style="font-size: 14pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 14pt;">marc and brian,<br></span></span></div><div><span style="font-size: 8pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 8pt;"><span style="font-size: 14pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 14pt;">as for the seals, i understand nothing.</span></span></div><div><span style="font-size: 8pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 8pt;"><span style="font-size: 14pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 14pt;">sounds like mumbo jumbo to me.<br></span></span></div><div><span style="font-size: 8pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 8pt;"><span style="font-size: 14pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 14pt;">what is the difference between the two seals?<br></span></span></div><div><span style="font-size: 8pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 8pt;"><span style="font-size: 14pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 14pt;">can you please explain, i'm not an expert in this matter.<br></span></span></div><div><span style="font-size: 8pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 8pt;"><span style="font-size: 14pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 14pt;">why should <em>kalrez</em> be better?<br></span></span></div><div><span style="font-size: 8pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 8pt;"><span style="font-size: 14pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 14pt;"><br></span></span></div><div><span style="font-size: 8pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 8pt;"><span style="font-size: 14pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 14pt;">also, brian and marc, check with george with regards to the gas system, especially with regards to matters like vapor pressure saturation curve, condensation temperature, etc. etc. before you fire off e-mails.<br></span></span></div><div><span style="font-size: 8pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 8pt;"><span style="font-size: 14pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 14pt;">for DSG, t<em>here is only one expert</em> on the gas system and that is George, you guys might be close but no...remember "a good man know his limitations".<br></span></span></div><div><span style="font-size: 8pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 8pt;"><span style="font-size: 14pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 14pt;"><br></span></span></div><div><span style="font-size: 8pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 8pt;"><span style="font-size: 14pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 14pt;">in any case, I think we have been <span style="font-size: 8pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 8pt;"><span style="font-size: 14pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 14pt;">futzing around with </span></span>the MVT gas system for way too long and it isn't even on my books?<br></span></span></div><div><span style="font-size: 8pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 8pt;"><span style="font-size: 14pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 14pt;"><br></span></span></div><div><span style="font-size: 8pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 8pt;"><span style="font-size: 14pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 14pt;">so marc and brian prepare a simple talk for tomorrow's meeting.<br></span></span></div><div><span style="font-size: 8pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 8pt;"><span style="font-size: 14pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 14pt;">i really would like to know how you plan to resolve this matter and when you plan to call it quits.<br></span></span></div><div><span style="font-size: 8pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 8pt;"><span style="font-size: 14pt;" data-mce-style="font-size: 14pt;">amrit<br></span></span></div><br></div><br><hr id="zwchr"><div><b>From: </b>"Marc Mcmullen" <mcmullen@jlab.org><br><b>To: </b>"Bob Miller" <rmiller@jlab.org>, "Brian Eng" <beng@jlab.org>, "Todd Ewing" <jtewing@jlab.org><br><b>Cc: </b>dsg-mvt@jlab.org, dsg-ft@jlab.org<br><b>Sent: </b>Tuesday, January 2, 2018 3:48:02 PM<br><b>Subject: </b>Re: [Dsg-mvt] MVT MFC Heaters<br></div><br><div>Bob,<br><br>We will monitor the enclosure temperature overnight, you may want to <br>make an adjustment to the enclosure temperature control we have seen it <br>peak at 54F and then drop to below 46F before the cycle started again.<br><br>We spoke with Steve Rockwood from MKS, he says there may be issues with <br>the Viton seals, and suggests using Kalrez as a possible alternative. We <br>are waiting for his final suggestion/report.<br><br>Once Todd has the CF4 hooked up we can test that MFC. As far as the <br>C4F10 MFC, the operating range is 10C - 50C, anything outside of that <br>and the unit will not perform to spec. We have seen that with the DC <br>MFCs when the temperature in the Gas Shed dropped below 50F.<br><br>The gas vapor pressure is specified to be 30psi @ 70F. Until we can get <br>the system stable to these numbers, we risk the operation of the MFC.<br><br>Marc<br><br><br>On 1/2/2018 2:17 PM, Bob Miller wrote:<br>> Hey Marc and Brian,<br>><br>> Todd is working on the heaters and insulation for the MFCs. The heat <br>> tape was limited to 5% by George. Todd has increased it to 20% and <br>> will monitor the inside temperature and adjust the heaters as <br>> necessary. The heaters will turn off when the thermostat reaches <br>> temperature anyway. 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